一位震驚世界的阿拉伯女性

The Middle East Media Research Institute
  
2/21/2006 Clip No. 1050

Arab-American Psychiatrist Wafa Sultan: There is No Clash of Civilizations but a Clash between the Mentality of the Middle Ages and That of the 21st Century

Following are excerpts from an interview with Arab-American psychiatrist Wafa Sultan. The interview was aired on Al-Jazeera TV on February 21, 2006

Wafa Sultan: The clash we are witnessing around the world is not a clash of religions, or a clash of civilizations. It is a clash between two opposites, between two eras. It is a clash between a mentality that belongs to the Middle Ages and another mentality that belongs to the 21st century. It is a clash between civilization and backwardness, between the civilized and the primitive, between barbarity and rationality. It is a clash between freedom and oppression, between democracy and dictatorship. It is a clash between human rights, on the one hand, and the violation of these rights, on other hand. It is a clash between those who treat women like beasts, and those who treat them like human beings. What we see today is not a clash of civilizations. Civilizations do not clash, but compete.

[...]

Host: I understand from your words that what is happening today is a clash between the culture of the West, and the backwardness and ignorance of the Muslims?

Wafa Sultan: Yes, that is what I mean.

[...]

Host: Who came up with the concept of a clash of civilizations? Was it not Samuel Huntington? It was not Bin Laden. I would like to discuss this issue, if you don't mind...

Wafa Sultan: The Muslims are the ones who began using this expression. The Muslims are the ones who began the clash of civilizations. The Prophet of Islam said: "I was ordered to fight the people until they believe in Allah and His Messenger." When the Muslims divided the people into Muslims and non-Muslims, and called to fight the others until they believe in what they themselves believe, they started this clash, and began this war. In order to stop this war, they must reexamine their Islamic books and curricula, which are full of calls for takfir and fighting the infidels.

My colleague has said that he never offends other people's beliefs. What civilization on the face of this earth allows him to call other people by names that they did not choose for themselves? Once, he calls them Ahl Al-Dhimma, another time he calls them the "eople of the Book," and yet another time he compares them to apes and pigs, or he calls the Christians "those who incur Allah's wrath." Who told you that they are "eople of the Book"? They are not the People of the Book, they are people of many books. All the useful scientific books that you have today are theirs, the fruit of their free and creative thinking. What gives you the right to call them "those who incur Allah's wrath," or "those who have gone astray," and then come here and say that your religion commands you to refrain from offending the beliefs of others?

I am not a Christian, a Muslim, or a Jew. I am a secular human being. I do not believe in the supernatural, but I respect others' right to believe in it.

Dr. Ibrahim Al-Khouli: Are you a heretic?

Wafa Sultan: You can say whatever you like. I am a secular human being who does not believe in the supernatural...

Dr. Ibrahim Al-Khouli: If you are a heretic, there is no point in rebuking you, since you have blasphemed against Islam, the Prophet, and the Koran...

Wafa Sultan: These are personal matters that do not concern you.

[...]

Wafa Sultan: Brother, you can believe in stones, as long as you don't throw them at me. You are free to worship whoever you want, but other people's beliefs are not your concern, whether they believe that the Messiah is God, son of Mary, or that Satan is God, son of Mary. Let people have their beliefs.

[...]

Wafa Sultan: The Jews have come from the tragedy (of the Holocaust), and forced the world to respect them, with their knowledge, not with their terror, with their work, not their crying and yelling. Humanity owes most of the discoveries and science of the 19th and 20th centuries to Jewish scientists. 15 million people, scattered throughout the world, united and won their rights through work and knowledge. We have not seen a single Jew blow himself up in a German restaurant. We have not seen a single Jew destroy a church. We have not seen a single Jew protest by killing people. The Muslims have turned three Buddha statues into rubble. We have not seen a single Buddhist burn down a Mosque, kill a Muslim, or burn down an embassy. Only the Muslims defend their beliefs by burning down churches, killing people, and destroying embassies. This path will not yield any results. The Muslims must ask themselves what they can do for humankind, before they demand that humankind respect them.

以下是阿拉伯世界的媒體對她採訪的對話：
原文翻譯如下:
　　我們今天見證的不是宗教間的衝突，也不是文明的衝突，而是正反間的交鋒，不同的時代，中世紀的思想與二十一世紀的思想之間的鬥爭，落後與文明，原始與文明，野蠻與理智，自由與壓迫，民主與專制，人權與踐踏人權，蔑視婦女如獸與尊重婦女如人之間的鬥爭。我們今天看到的並不是文明之間的衝突，不同的文明不會衝突，只會競爭。
　　問：你的意思是今天的衝突一方是西方文化，另一方是落後無知的穆斯林？
　　答：沒錯。
　　問：是誰說的文明衝突，不是享廷頓嗎，肯定不是本拉登。
　　答：是穆斯林先使用的字眼，是穆斯林開始的文明衝突。伊斯蘭先知說：我必須為了讓人們相信安拉和信使而戰鬥。當穆斯林把人們分為穆斯林和非穆斯林時起，並且號召為他人皈依伊斯蘭教而戰時，他們開始了衝突，開始了戰爭。為了制止戰爭，我們有必有重審經典教義。這些經典教義充滿了消滅異教徒的訓示。我的同事說他沒有侵害別人的宗教，可是在這個世界上誰給了他為別人起名字的權力？給自己起名字是人家自己的權力。可是他叫他們ahi al –dhimma, 還叫他們經書之人，還叫他們猴子和豬，他說基督徒是安拉憎恨之人，誰告訴你他們只是經書之人？他們是無數書本之人，今天你能讀到的所有科學的書都是他們寫的。這是他們自由創新思維的果實。誰給了你權力把他們稱為安拉憎恨之人？或稱他們為迷途之人？然後來到這裡，若無其事地說你的宗教沒有教會你侵害別人的宗教？我不信基督，不信伊斯蘭，也不是猶太人，只是一個俗人，我不相信超自然的力量，但是我尊重別人信仰的權利。
　　問：你是邪教徒嗎？
　　答：隨你說什麼都行。我是一個普通的俗人。不相信超自然的力量。
　　問：如果你是一個邪教徒，那我們沒有什麼好爭的。你褻瀆了伊斯蘭，真主，可蘭經。
　　答：我信什麼是你管不著的個人事務。你相信石頭也行，只要你不要拿它來砸我。你有信仰的自由。但是別人的信仰是別人的事。即使米賽亞是上帝，是瑪麗的兒子，或者說撒旦是上帝，是瑪麗的兒子，這是人們的自由。猶太人經歷了災難。但是人們尊敬他們是因為他們和知識，而不是他們的恐怖。是勤勞，不是哭泣和喊叫。人類十九世紀和二十世紀的發現和科學歸功於猶太科學家。他們一千五百萬人失散各地，因為勤勞和知識得到權利。我們沒有聽說過有那一個猶太人在德國人的餐館里當人肉炸彈。也沒有聽說過猶太人毀掉別人的教堂。沒聽說過猶太人為了抗議就殺人。穆斯林毀了三尊大佛。但是有那個佛教徒毀過清真寺？殺死過一個穆斯林，燒掉一個外國大使館？只有穆斯林為了自己的信仰燒教堂，殺人，燒使館。這條道路是走不通的。穆斯林們應該問一下自己能為全人類做些什麼事。而不僅僅是要求得到人們尊敬。

Adelyn, is it your work? Very good indeed!

Hat's off to this brave woman! I am sure she has taken the right words right out of many decent people's mouth throughout the world. Good on her, our dear sister!

thanks. no. it's not my translation. it was a copy-and-paste work. i didn't finish reading the chinese translation. that's not important. the original transcript about her interview is excellent. though technically not perfect english, her words are powerful and have a far reaching influence on the world, thanks to the internet.

Hi, dear Adelyn, I'm proud of you. We learn English, that is not just for making a living. Our final goal is knowing and influencing this world. Building right world consciousness is very important.

We were taught we should respect religions from childhood, but religions are totally exclusive in nature! They take infidels, such as you and me, as the ones they should annihilate(Islam) or enslave(Hinduism). The reason they put it aside temporarily is only that they haven't enough power. We should keep clear-headed all the time. This is truely for world peace!